Irish Independent,
Bruce Arnold
It is difficult to pinpoint quite where Pope Benedict is focusing his mind when he issues a statement such as that contained in his traditional, end-of-the-year speech to Vatican cardinals and bishops, publicly released yesterday. He claimed that, as recently as the 1970s, ‘paedophilia was theorized as something fully in conformity with man and even with children’. He went on to state, as the context for this quite extraordinary interpretation of how paedophilia has been considered, that ‘there is no such thing as evil in itself or good in itself. There is only a ‘better than’ and a ‘worse than.’ Nothing is good or bad in itself.’
He could not have chosen a worse moment to have issued such a message on the great crime of the third millennium, nor to have framed it in such confused terms and with so many examples of passing the blame to society and current moral standards.
Paedophilia – since he used the term – is an obsessive sexual deviation in which adult males lust after pre-pubescent children. They cannot easily control nor suppress their sexual urges and they are responsible for criminal acts against young children that form part – but only part – of child sex abuse.
A greater part of the sexual abuse that was committed by brothers and priest of the Roman Catholic Church against children imprisoned in Ireland’s industrial school network came under a broader category as did the abuse by priests of young people
in parishes.The distinction is important since it helps to define the kinds of treatments and punishments that should be applied. It also helps to explain how the obsessive and uncontrollable nature of paedophilia, and the child-state of potential victims has bred into existence on a growing scale paedophile rings, which by their nature are highly dangerous to children and extremely difficult for the police to fight.
This latter difficulty has been greatly enlarged in Ireland because of political pusillanimity towards the Church, allowing priests and bishops to intimidate the gardai and other public servants against interfering with Church control, or lack of control, of the sexual urges of its members.
That said, the nonsensical claim made by the Pope in his end-of-year message to the world – something that cannot but spread further confusion – contains the idea that somehow paedophilia was ‘normal’ until quite recently.
Paedophilia has not been ‘normal’, in the modern era, save in an entirely theoretical sense of examining, as Kinsey or Freud might examine, sexual deviation. That apart, a paedophile who turns his desires for sexual congress with a pre-pubescent child is almost certain, in a very short space of time, to cross the boundary of criminality and will soon commit serious, indictable offences.
In normal societies this has resulted in prison sentences for sexual assault, including buggery. And this legal constraint against a wide range of sexual offences has a substantial body of law backing it up. Ireland, in these circumstances, cannot be regarded as a ‘normal’ society. If it were, the forces of law and order would have prevented a large number of the criminal acts now being brought to the courts, and having been brought to the courts in recent years, ever happening. It is clear, notably and most recently, from the evidence in the Murphy Report, that the Church ran nothing less than a protection racket, stopping the law being properly implemented. This made us abnormal.
The abnormality is by no means confined to Ireland. Each society in the world has to come to terms with the power of the Church, its domestic remit and the strongly conservative voice of the Vatican laying down, or often not laying down, directives that make sense.
What the world needs to hear is a clear statement about the importance of civil law in all societies, as opposed to Canon Law. This has been at the root of a great deal of evil in respect of child sexual abuse. It has legitimised the concealment of offenders by senior prelates not themselves necessarily involved in abuse. It has given strength to the passive acceptance of clerical privilege even when this is a total assault on principles of lawful behaviour.
Pope Benedict, in his statement, chose to confuse rather than clarify. We do not need to see the matter ‘in a broader social context, in which child pornography is seemingly considered normal by society and drug use and sexual tourism are on the rise’. These are separate issues. Terrible as child pornography is, a priest or member of a religious community buggering a pre-pubescent child is much worse. It is also not necessary for the Pope to take us, yet again, through the matter of the Church’s “humiliation” nor the need for “renewal”.
If one is to accept the logic of the Pope’s message, it is that it took ‘an avalanche of cases of paedophile priests’ to bring about a change in the Church’s view of how criminality is to be dealt with when the criminals are priests.
It is particularly sad that this traditional Christmas speech to Vatican cardinals and bishops, an eagerly anticipated address that Benedict uses to focus the church hierarchy on key issues, should have delivered us with a message of such confusion.
It lacks the focus it needed. It lacks the response millions of people wished for. It lacks precision of thought and clarity about blame for a known disease that has resided in the Church, because the Church has offered easy occasion for access to those in its membership who are paedophiles. It lack realism in bringing the Church up to date in its thinking.
….. it’s his prerogative, it’s called free will…
FREE WILL ? ANY / ALL OF THIS WARPED THINKING IS THE CONSEQUENCE OF “BRAIN-WASHING”, AND OF THE CONTROLLED AND IMPLACABLY IMPOSED “WILL AND DEMANDS” OF OUR TEACHERS/EDUCATORS/MOSTLY OUR PARENTS.
Portia, like yourself Focault rejected everything that the Catholic Church ( including the Jesuits ) stood for. It’s his prerogative, it’s called free will. He was in awe of the nihilist, Nitzche. The latter died in a mental asylum, Focault died of aids. Maybe they should have heeded the Church/Jesuits after all. Ironically, the Catholic Church is the biggest provider of care to aids victims in the world. Surprisingly enough, atheists are not big into such care. It’s easier to sit on the fence & sneer/critisize !.
When i said the people outside i meant the handfull of psys who wanted to think that small children fell in love with adults.Idont think that the pope should hide behind these people.Lots of things were being said but we are all free to think for ourselves.The pain caused by abuse was a well known fact for the church as thay had the experence. and in the industriel schools life was hell for the children. no psy said its okay to beat the children. or to starve them overwork them. that was thier policy. Iagree that everyone in Ireland lived in fear of the church.
Eric.
Michel Foucaul attended the JESUIT Collège Saint-Stanislas. That explains a lot.
Pauline I agree. But people outside outside DID KNOW of the abuse and rapes of children “in care”.
It does not matter if they make the old pope a saint or not- it is only a title given by men.
Mother Teresa will no doubt be made a saint too- even though she was as corrupt as any of them and guilty of causing pain and suffering to her fellow brothers and sisters.
I tell you,sure, selective memory is an amazing asset.!
Eric- yes and that is why HSE agents often turn a blind eye to incest, rape of sons and daughters. I can say with hand on heart that I was shocked to witness this for myself in Ireland in 1995 and even today in Australia and other countries.
Social workers are paid to protect children not punish them for disclosing abuse, not giving them ECT to burn out the memories, so the rapist can walk free. It is not just the church.
As for the pope and his words- merely words. Feel the energy and tell me it comes from his heart?
but as children we were put under the protection of the church. no matter what was being said by people outside ‘ we were supposed to be safe with the nuns and priests otherwise the courts would have had to find another solution.its not the fault of Society outside. after all we all choose what we think . its just another way of trying to justify hurting children . on the news today it was said that the dead pope is going to be a saint.this is going to happen on the first of may . nd its a well known fact that he excepted the rape of children. dead or not he was a pervert. and he dearly loved the perverts around him.But he did not care about the future of the children put under his protection. i suppose the other saints will love him . after all thay are all a bit wierd
Portia, absolutely correct. But in addition to Kinsey many later so-called free thinkers ( the worse being the French so-called intellectual Michel Foucault ) supported inter-generational sex : & they were lauded as progressive liberals. At least the Pope had the good grace to apologise for the ” filth ” who had infiltrated the church. The Maltese victims of clergy abuse were impressed by the Popes sincerity/contrition.
Derek.
There are no human rights because the men of god do not see the sheeple as humans, but cattle. it is this dissonance that makes it easy for them to rape children and not feel guilty.
Eric,
Kinsey supported sexual relations between adults and children in the 1940’s.Richard Gardner and Underwager also cited that no harm came to children during rape sessions with adults and these experts still have their opinions cited in family law, where convicted paedophiles have custody with judges telling children to lock their bedroom doors at night? So much for child protection among the judiciary in 2011 then.
I include link so all can see.
http://www.bubhub.com.au/community/forums/showthread.php?p=4585160
The Popes analysis is absolutely correct. It is a matter of fact that the liberal/feminist elite in the 1960’s & 1970’s were ideologically supporting sexual relations between children & adults & contending that it was of no harm to the child. The liberal/feminist position is totally hypocritical. Rather than apologise for their heinous ideology they lash out at Pope Benedict.
Derek Linster
Derek web http://www.derekleinster.com, you can contact me, by web it is with shame that I tell you, that there is no human rights, or any rights what so every for non Catholics from the Bethany home & what is more there is, place to get help, but if we had being born outside of Ireland the ihrc,& all of the good Church people would have being happy to help, how mad is that? Regards, Derek.
Redmond, You are so right.
The brainwashing begins in the womb.What sheeple in their right minds would attend church over Christmas
The sheeple rather deny the truth of their cult leaders than accept responsibility for the rape and torture of innocent children.
The Pope has also tried to convice the sheeple that pedophilia was considered “normal” in the 1970’s. But who exactly is “We”?
Oh the walls will surely crumble and the sleeping beauties/Irish Catholics will wake up suddenly from their brainwashed state.
The old codger might be cuter than we think!
Over Christmas, many Irish churches were filled to the brim with young and old, some in tears, some even wailing in delight at the fully fledged magic shows on the offer accompanied by heavenly choirs and scents and bells and magnificent costumes and heavenly advice about the family on offer. Such splendour as the opium was dished out in heavenly form. Did you attend?
Could it be that there is still a large population out there willing to submit itself in body and thought to the underlying adoration of another golden cow. Seems so. Whats so different about this cow?
Well its hard to tell whats different about this golden cow. One thing is for sure, it easily harnesses the obedience and acquiescence of its quiet followers despite the abominable truths about its nature which sets mother against child victims, state against citizens and poisons history with vile turpitude and darkness.
What acually is the physiological state of the mass goers bearing in mind that whole nations have been brainwashed in the recent past to commmit the most ferocious genocide. It would almost seem that the ready submission of mass goers to the vatican holy performances over christmas, indicates that brainwashing has been successful and continues to be so even for those who perceive them selves to be entirely with religious affiliation but yet attend church.
Here’s the rub. Vatican Propagandist, Joseph Ratzinger knows the value and strength of providing ‘get out of culpability’ themes to the mass goers. In the brainwashed state, the mass goers have reduced sensitivity to truth and self reasoning. Arising from this, Ratzinger speaks directly to his followers, not his critics nor accusers and in doing so, strengthens the loyal followers to withstand self questioning and that is all that is needs.
He is cute because he does not provide any response to those who ask him to account for the truth, no good can come of it, the hole will only get deeper, better to strengthen the remains by bolstering and rallying the remaining troops. Its a true corporate or militarist strategy, blunt and obtuse in its nature with denial central to its success. Its a gamble and a drastic one, its a sign of desperate weakness and in the commercial world, it often fails but it also succeeds. Remember tobacco.
For this very reason, its important to keep broadcasting the truth about the Vatican.
The walls may be about to tumble.
Portia wrote:-
“That begs the question – which adult did the man called pope learn his deviance from.?”
From his own parents, i.e., his primary role models/mentors, as a child. So, if his own parents were INFATUATED by Roman Catholic dogma, then Benedict hadn’t got a chance of becoming a NORMAL adult – ergo his penchant for dressing up in frocks made of gold, and other such absurdities…
As you say Portia:-
“Not every abused child becomes an abuser – though the % is high.”
Sadly, the percentage of those whon were routinely abused (read: psychologically TORTURED) as children is actually very high. And those who are conditioned to accept emotional abuse as being normal are the ones most likely to repeat their tragic (perverse) history. C’est la vie…
just take a look at our own government to see what the lasting effects of such a warped childhood does to adults …
Martha. I totally agree with you. That begs the question – which adult did the man called pope learn his deviance from.?
This abuse within the Catholic cult is generations old.The SS regime also had a hand in the making of the pope, which also created emotionless human beings suffering disassociative identity disorder, etc.
That still does not excuse the pope for his actions.
Not every abused child becomes an abuser – though the % is high.
Sean, do you remember many of the fathers and mothers of the sixtees and seventees who were too scared of the men of god and did not speak out. Instead the abused children were told to wash their mouths out with salt- rather than say a bad word about the men of god.? I remember it oh so very well.
To say that
…THE ABNORMALITY IS BY NO MEANS CONFINED TO IRELAND
or
…WHAT THE WORLD NEEDS TO HEAR (from the Pope)
TO SAY THAT IS NOT HELPFUL. IT IS TAKING AWAY, DISTRACTING FROM AND DILUTING THE IRISH SCANDALS. THE CRIMES COMMITTED HERE HAVE BEEN / ARE STILL, THE WORST IN THE WORLD.
FERNS, RYAN’S, MURPHY, THE MAGDALENS, THE NON-CATHOLICS, CLOYNE ARE ALL IRISH PROBLEMS.
THE FACT THAT IRELAND HAS EXPORTED THIS POISON TO FOREIGN SHORES AND IS RESPONSIBLE FOR THE MAJORITY OF THESE CRIMES OVERSEAS, DOES NOTHING FOR THE MEN AND WOMEN WHO WERE ABUSED HERE.
THE POPE NEEDED TO TALK TO IRELAND ONLY; TO ADDRESS THE IRISH PEOPLE ONLY; TO APOLOGIZE UNCONDITIONALLY TO THE IRISH VICTIMS ONLY; TO OFFER UNLIMITED HELP IN THE INQUIRIES; TO TAKE ACTION AGAINST THE CRIMINAL PRIESTS, BISHOPS, ARCHBISHOPS AND CARDINALS IN HIS CHURCH HERE; TO SWEAR THESE CRIMES WERE NEVER GOING TO BE ALLOWED TO HAPPEN AGAIN TO IRISH CHILDREN; AND TO OFFER APPROPRIATE COMPENSATION TO THE INJURED PARTIES AS DECIDED BY THE IRISH COURTS.
DON’T GENERALIZE – STAY SPECIFIC.
DON’T MAKE SWEEPING STATEMENTS – ADDRESS THE ISSUES SQUARELY AS THEY STAND ON THE RECORD.
NO BUT’S. NO IF’S. NO EXCUSES WHATSOEVER.
ANALYZING AND INTELLECTUAL DIALOGUE DO NOTHING FOR THE SPECIFIC ISSUES IF IT ALLOWS THE MINDS TO STRAY AND WANDER FROM THE CRIMES, THE VICTIMS, AND MORE TO THE POINT – THE CRIMINALS THEMSELVES, AND ALL THEIR HELPERS.
OF COURSE, THE WAY THE POPE TALKS TO HIS FLOCK IS EXACTELY THE SAME AS
HOW THE POLITICIANS TALK TO THE IRISH PEOPLE,
AND WE TALK TO OUR CHILDREN.
THE BRAIN-WASHING IS COMPLETE AND TOTAL. FROM THE TOP DOWN – IN A VICIOUS POISONED CIRCLE.
ONLY ‘THEY’ ALWAYS KEEP CONTROL, SQUEEZE AND ABUSE.
Portia wrote: ”
The pope shows the personality of a devious child using every excuse he can think of to avoid getting into trouble with his elders.”
Portia, with respect, the only reason why a child is deviant is because his/her “elders” (parents/guardians) are themselves deviant.
ALL children learn their habits (good, bad and indifferent) from their primary role models, ie., their primary guardians, usually their own parents.
Sean Morrison wrote:-
“A powerful voice in a childs life is what is needed…”
Sean, the ONLY powerful voice a child needs is (ideally) its own mother, or father. And if the child has the misfortune of not having such an advocate, be it in the form of a surrogate parent who has the child’s best interests at heart, then sadly such an “orphaned” child is at the mercy of the predators and parasites in our midst – of which there is no shortage in a society that has been shaped by religious dogma, such as Catholicised Ireland.
Bruce Arnold begins this article (and I have read it in full) with the following:-
“It is difficult to pinpoint quite where Pope Benedict is focusing his mind … ”
Why is it so difficult for Bruce Arnold, and others, to make sense of the Pope’s mentality, when he (Pope Benedict) is the head of the Roman Catholic Church aka The Vatican – which is a totally corrupt institution, as ANY normal adult knows?
In short, why argue with one who is so OBVIOUSLY a lunatic?
In Brazil two or three years ago a 9 year old girl became pregnant ‘ she had been raped by her stepfarther. her mother took her to see a doctor’ who said she hade to have an aborton because she was expecting twins . because of her age her mother excepted and it was carried through . but the local priest wrote to the vatican to find out if he could give her access to the church . the answer from the vatican was to excomunicate both the child and her mother.these people dont know what caring about people is about.But thay are dangerous.
This man (the Pope)is not of SOUND MIND nor are his idiotic henchmen to speak thus.
When he visited the U.K. recently I was of the profound belief that he was SENILE. this has now been confirmed. I will give respect when it is deserved. This man and sadly the majority of the men and women of the cloth do not deserve such.
The Catholic Church’s representatives have destroyed many Irish Families which can never be rebuilt.
Kathleen O’Malley. “Childhood Interrupted”
Bruce, there is no confusion really, just a pretend confusion on the part of the pope. It is the use of deceptive intelligence at its finest. The words of the pope are meant to cause anger and confusion. This is nothing new to the men of “god”. They have used this trick on the innocent sheeple for thousands of years and got away with it. Now, thanks to you and Paddy, the sheep are waking up to the forked tongues of these men of “god”.
The pope shows the personality of a devious child using every excuse he can think of to avoid getting into trouble with his elders.
Like Kinsey, he would like to normalise pedophilia. But what about the sadistic cruelty used in this abuse of children.?
Also, in the making of porn and snuff movies innocent human children are used and some die in the process.
Perhaps the people of Ireland are still in denial because that saves them from accepting responsibility as a nation re the horrors endured by our children. Make no mistake, there were many adults who knew and know of the horrors endured by children at the hands of the men of god and those adults turned a blind eye. Now conscience asks the question?? WHY.?
http://www.jesusneverexisted.com/murderers.htm
in 1970 i was a perent If anyone had tried to interfere with my child i would have done everything in my power to protect her from that . this pope is highly confuses. he should have read Fraud. he desperatly needs to see a good psy.
If “Jesus” was a franchise, then Benedict who appears to be as out of control as his organisation, would have been instantly sacked from his position for this statement!
Enough said, the cat is out of the bag, it is now common knowledge what has been and is still going on. We have another problem now, Groups jumping on the bandwaggon with a cash flow from the various sections of the Irish Govt etc. A powerful voice in a childs life is what is needed now in the UK and Ireland. Here in Maricopa County, Arizona, (volunteers) are being called to help, not funded blood suckers as in the UK and Ireland, It’s called CASA, “Court Appointed Special Advocate” Check out, if you are here in the Arizona area. http://www.maricopacasa.org.