By Noel Baker
Monday, February 20, 2012
The new Papal Nuncio began his mission to Ireland by echoing the words of Archbishop of Dublin Diarmuid Martin in pledging to help heal a “wounded” Church.
At the liturgical reception for Archbishop Charles J Brown, the new Apostolic Nuncio said Pope Benedict had been “scandalised and dismayed” over the abuse perpetrated by Catholic priests.
The comments from both men, made at Dublin’s Pro-Cathedral, come as the row over the closure of Ireland’s Embassy in the Vatican rumbled on.
In welcoming Archbishop Brown to Dublin, Archbishop Martin said pointedly: “The diplomatic relations between the Holy See and Ireland have been fruitful in fostering the interests of Ireland, of the Holy See and of our common interests in the good of the human family.”
Afterwards Dr Martin said he was confident the Irish embassy to the Vatican would reopen “in some other way” — only for the Department of Foreign Affairs to reiterate that its decision to close the Vatican embassy would not be reviewed.
Archbishop Brown’s predecessor, Giuseppe Leanza, became embroiled in friction between the Government and Rome over the fall-out from the clerical child sex abuse scandals, but yesterday his American successor said the Vatican was committed to dealing with abuse and abusers.
“Pope Benedict was scandalised and dismayed as he learned about the tragedy of abuse perpetrated by some members of the clergy and of religious congregations,” he said. “He felt deeply the wounds of those who had been harmed and who so often had not been listened to.
“From the beginning, Pope Benedict was resolute and determined to put into place changes which would give the Church the ability to deal more effectively with those who abuse trust, as well as to provide the necessary assistance to those who had been victimised. Pope Benedict has been relentless and consistent on this front, and I assure you that he will continue to be.”
He also said the Church could be a place of healing.
“The Church herself is wounded by the sins of her members,” he told the congregation. “And just as sin produces a kind of spiritual paralysis in the individual, a radical lack of the spiritual energy which is grace, so too there can be a kind of spiritual paralysis in sections of the Church, where that energy seems to have disappeared, enthusiasm is dissipated, liturgical life grows cold.”
Perhaps referring to the context of the row between Dublin and Rome last year over the alleged lack of co-operation in child abuse probes, Archbishop Brown said: “Sin should not be understood primarily as a breaking of a rule or as violating the regulations. Sin is not, in the first instance, something legal.”
He said sin was “a spiritual disease which afflicts us, which can paralyse us” but which could be healed through the Church, particularly through the Holy Eucharist.
“The Holy See and Ireland have deep-rooted links, which go back long into our history,” he said
“International relations and diplomacy are concerned not just with the political and economic challenges of the day, no matter how vital, but with the fundamental values and aspirations of people which must then shape relations between peoples and States and in this context the Holy See plays a vital role.”
Oops, Mister Brown, what healing can one have to a corpse, Rigamortis has set in too long ago. Oh no! Not another Vatican miracle. Twisted Oliver.
Thank you Robert what a lovely compliment you have paid to all the ladies.
Thanks robert. As we are all scattered over the planet we can only suppose that this is another way of using victims. many of us are too old for these passtimes.and after all these years of groups choosing who to help out by taking one or two on fishing holidays has been a tole on us. its frustrating to feel used.
Today the web site of the vatican was closes down by agroup of hackers. thay did it to protest against them. The way the abuse cases were hidden and the fact that thay are using canon law to protect themselves.
you minister and the government should not be in power you are clearly corrupt if you can take from all the survivors you are no good to run ireland all of ireland should know what you are doing and what kind of people you are can you not see how bad this is and what you are doing this will one day come back on you what goes around comes around
Now I have said that I am thinking of every woman that went through life from those places, I actually believe you are all the strongest and the best there is on the planet, you are the very best this earth has to offer, have a wonderful peaceful day ladies love Robert xx
It is International women’s day today I just wonder if anyone remembered the Madeleine laundry women, who are properly all alone in a room somewhere, I bet the Religious have not even mentioned them, God I so hate this world and it’s sick leaders from State to Religion we are robbed of life and spirit.
I just posted this on the Independent news online
As the way I see it is that both State and church has failed miserably to even try and put right the damage done to survivors.
Education, counseling, are already free for those on lower income,for the unemployed and on sickness.
The Government are guilty charging survivors tax on their redress as they have to use the banks to withdraw their money the more they need to use the bank the more they pay including dirt tax yet the redress is supposed to be free from taxing. The Government also are guilty in setting up a statuary fund on money given freely by the people after they paid their taxes from their own pockets does this now mean the Government can now dictate how charities are to use their money given freely by the people of Ireland?
The Government are also guilty of taking needed funds for survivors, to the sum of 600 million plus euro, claiming it to be the churches 50% towards all costs. They already earned back millions in taxes from the payments paid as example wages and so forth.
They are just as guilty as the Church in their own words in the Dail, so does this now mean if two people commit the same crime they can now only do 50% each of the time or pay 50% each of the fine?
For the past 11 years all of what he mentions has been the objective of several groups. Thay use the fund as thay wish. I dont believe that the survivers of these institutions have recieved any benefit.From what i understand from different comments it seems to me that nothing is actually done except for close family members or in some cases for those who dident go to the redress board. this is one of the things i dont understand at all. After all why mention industriel school survivers when we all have had time to see that its a cover for the groups put there in the first place by the government. what thay are for is part of the mystery.
207. Deputy Sandra McLellan asked the Minister for Education and Skills if he is still determined to set up a trust fund for the survivors of institutional abuse; when the trust fund will be put in place; if his attention has been drawn to the survivors’ objection to the trust fund; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [9339/12]
Minister for Education and Skills (Deputy Ruairí Quinn): I am committed to establishing the proposed Statutory Fund for survivors of institutional abuse and as work on the drafting of the Bill is at an advanced stage, I hope to be in a position to publish the Bill in the coming weeks.
I am aware that some former residents advocated a simple distribution of the available money rather than the establishment of the Statutory Fund. However, as I outlined when I published the legislative proposals, I believe that the Fund should target resources at services to support former residents’ needs. The General Scheme provides for approved services to include, counselling, psychological support services and mental health services together with such health and personal social services, educational services and housing services as the Fund may determine.
The truth is this minister quinn has no idea at all what survivors need because he never listened, neither did the rest of the Government
http://transparency.ie/
for those interested in making known their views on anything to do with survivors of abuse
Another noncio, another no-mark parachuted in by the vatican weighed down by the usual sickening rhetoric and unabated crap surrounded by the must have smoke and mirrors to ply his trade.
This archbishop geezer Brown and his !!wounded!! church approach merely represents an antithesis as an avocation to HIS profession based upon customary practices used by this catholic church for centuries, ie, fear and hell fire, damnation and all the other pap used to instill abject fear into the intellectually challenged morons stupid enough to STILL believe or think this catholic chuch set-up in Ireland remains a credible organisation.
As Redmond Barry above states “”ciziten brown”” , a good name for this geezer. As a protege of his master Ratzo and “”heavily”” qualified in the philosophical and “legal” world of religion , ciziten brown will be painfully aware that moral codes have suffered from the exaggerated claims made for them , and nowhere is this exemplified better than in Ireland in very recent years, as bishop after bishop fell by the wayside as THEIR ” moral codes” were proven to be non-existent, none more so than the disgraced cardinal Connell, not to mention of course that up there in Armagh in the shape of Sean Brady a man given to FRIGHTENING innocent children into SECRECY concerning RAPE AND OTHER VILE CRIMES COMMITTED BY THE religious. Would ciziten brown care to comment on that, and further, what steps has ciziten brown taken to remove this Brady. ??
Has ciziten brown formulated some new ” miracle” cure for his devastated church, has ciziten brown accepted that his doomed church must first perish before assuming a new function in the process of re-generation.??
AND THIS “” RE-GENERATION”” WHATEVER IT IS, MUST FIRST BE GROUNDED UPON THE PRINCIPLE THAT THIS catholic church IN IRELAND AND ITS ASSOCIATED LOWER RANKING LACKEYS, christian brothers and nuns MUST FIRST PAY FOR THEIR CRIMES , AND PAY HEAVILY, NOT INTO THE EXCHEQUEUR BUT INTO THE HANDS OF THOSE THOUSANDS OF CHILDREN WHO WERE BRUTALIZED BY THIS MOST BRUTAL OF ORGANISATIONS.
CITIZEN BROWN HAS AN UPHILL BATTLE.
Bereavement grants
Information
Rates
Information
There are three types of grant that may be paid when someone dies.
A standard Bereavement Grant is a once-off payment made when someone dies. Eligibility for this grant is not related to your ability to pay for the funeral. Eligibility is based on PRSI contributions.
In addition (depending on your circumstances), you may be able to apply for some other social welfare payments. For example; the Widowed or Surviving Civil Partner Grant for widows/widowers/surviving civil partners with dependent children.
You may also be eligible for a Special Funeral Grant (under the Occupational Injuries Benefits scheme).
Rates
A Bereavement Grant is a payment of €850. The grant is usually paid to the person responsible for payment of the funeral bill. (For example, the grant can be paid to the husband, wife, civil partner, personal representative or next-of-kin of the deceased person).
In addition to the Bereavement Grant, you may also be entitled to a Widowed or Surviving Civil Partner Grant of €6,000 for widows/widowers/civil partners with dependent children.
You may also be eligible for a Special Funeral Grant (under the Occupational Injuries Benefits scheme) of €850.
Payments are made by cheque.
WHEN IT COMES TO SURVIVORS I just found my Mother over a year ago, buried her last week had no money to go, was only allowed 200 euro for traveling costs only, then a demand of proof and receipts without any sincerity’s.
I could not afford to stay anywhere so had to beg a family i never knew before to stay, and could not even afford the flowers for her grave.
So called support for survivors, The Government said they must listen hear and understand survivors. This was their answer to it all.
What do their expenses cover I just wonder? taking in mind most of these morons have businesses of their own.
Family tracing? feck you all who allows so much grief you are the most disgusting animals on this fecken planet you the Government, the Religious, and Lawyers, Media, BLOOD SUCKING FILTHY GROUPS.
From Wiki
Priesthood details of Citizen Brown………
He was ordained a priest for the Archdiocese of New York by Cardinal John Joseph O’Connor on 13 May 1989[6] in St. Patrick’s Cathedral, New York. From 1989 to 1991 he was assistant priest at St. Brendan’s Parish in the Bronx, New York City. From 1994 to his appointment as nuncio, he worked as an official of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith. He became a Chaplain of His Holiness on 6 May 2000. He was appointed Adjunct Secretary of the International Theological Commission in September 2009.
The Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, the curial department where he worked, has dealt with child abuse scandals since 1994,[7][4][8][9][10] when it was headed by the then Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger, who as Pope Benedict XVI appointed him nuncio.
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The critical point here is that his boss, Ratzinger trained him in ‘How to deal with Child abuse’…..in that special Ratzinger way and we all know what that means.
As Putin is to Stalin, Brown is to Ratzinger.
When will the church start caring about the fact that its about the lives destroyed by them. Its not about them yet. First the protection of future children. Since it seems to be impossable to choose between the abusers and child protection well its up to adults to change things. People who can not be trusted with children should be kept away from them. and not be talking about gratitude towards a pope whom we all know protected the abusers by placeing them in other parishes.This isint new its been going on for a long time now and its time that the church in the person of daidmund martin complaining all the time about criticisim.
Dear Mr Brown ( may I call you that?) while your at it why not pick up a copy of the Ryan Report and the Murphy Report and the Cloyne Report and soon there will be the Magdalene Report and read them. You may wonder why we are getting increasingly angry , it is because of of three questions (1) What did you know about the abuse of children by your church?. (2) When did you know about it?. (3) What did you do about it?. If you can not answer these questions then it means you are not doing your job , you are supposed to know . Now tell your boss that and by the way welcome to Ireland we promise your stay will be memorable. Oh don’t forget to take your words to the laundry we are tired of them.
Right Mr Brown , This seems to be all about how your boss feels , how dismayed he is, how scandilised he has become . Its all about him and his feelings . We Irish are tired and weary of your words , you need to take them to a laundry for washing . They lack credibility and pondus. You say your boss has been relentless and consistent in demanding that victims of clerical terror be provided with assistance . When the Irish government requested that the 18 Catholic orders contribute monies to the redress for victims they told the minister to go away . Now Mr Brown would you do us all a favour and ring your boss and tell him to stoke the fires in hell for the Irish Christain Brothers who refuse to obey your boss. I mean if what you are saying is true then why do you allow these orders to disobey your church?. Do you have a shismatic movement within you church ?. It appears so .
I have always been intrigued by the word “SIN” especially in the way it is interpreted by the Catholic Church.
To me, the word sin means mistake, pure and simple. A mistake is just that, a mistake. We all make mistakes – as the saying goes: “To err is to be human”. And if we are human (enough) we learn from our mistakes. If we’re not, then we just keep repeating the same mistakes in the belief we are not making any mistakes at all, which reminds me of another saying: “The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting to get a different result” .
Just sayin… gonna go off now to make some more mistakes… I just love being human! LOL!
Words and mumbo jumbo from Ratzingers lackeys as usual. You’d need a searchlight to find any real meaning in all the double talk and bollocksology.
The church is wounded. now isint that really odd that the pope whos job was to deal with all this now says he was unaware of abuse. in the future child protection is urgent because these men have no problem about lying again and again.the victims and witnesses are really wounded.thay are still getting help from the government to swell the numbers of catholics in Ireland. Its to keep them powerfull. the popes have known for years about the way these nuns and priests acted with the children in thier care. Not one of them have shown any respect for thier victims.it sounds as if thay dont live here on earth but thay know how to make millions so thats a facade.
It seems to me a fact of life that these guys just don’t get it at all. I’m sure I echo the sentiments of many people who were abused by the ‘men of the cloth’ when I say that apologies are wearing very thin and becoming tiresome. Another batch of Cardinals created by Benny. Jobs for the boys, BOYS OH BOYS!